|
Thunder Gazette
Printed from: Fantasy Thunder Forums
Topic URL: http://www.elproyectovenus.org/members/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=6953
Printed on: 05/12/2006
Topic:
Topic author: Drafters
Subject: Thunder Gazette
Posted on: 02/07/2006 10:53:21 AM
Message: Some Middle East observers believe Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's letter to President Bush could be a precursor to war, based on a traditional Muslim pattern of offering acceptance of Islam before establishing it by force.
Robert Spencer, editor of Jihad Watch, says Ahmadinejad appears to be following the teachings of Muhammad, who gave specific instructions to followers as they engage in "holy war" against "those who disbelieve in Allah."
In a Hadith, regarded by Muslims as sacred writings about Muhammad, the Islamic prophet says a series of offers should be made to "enemies" to embrace Islam, or at least accept Islamic rule, and if they are rejected, "seek Allah's help and fight them."
In his letter, Ahmadinejad argues only Islam can "overcome the present problems of the world" and asks Bush, "Will you not accept this invitation? That is, a genuine return to the teachings of prophets, to monotheism and justice, to preserve human dignity and obedience to the Almighty and His prophets? Mr President, History tells us that repressive and cruel governments do not survive."
Another observer of Islam, journalist Stephen Adams, said the letter seems to parallel a missive from al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden to Americans prior to the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.
Interviewed on the Michael Medved radio show yesterday, Adams noted bin Laden stated his grievances against the United States and gave Americans the opportunity to "repent."
Based on precedent, Adams continued, he expects the next step will be for Iran to make the invitation public. Then the "crimes" of the U.S. will be published and the grievances will be cited at Friday prayers in mosques. Finally, comes a fatwa, amounting to a declaration of war.
Adams, associate editor of Citizen magazine, said it's possible this scenario could unfold in a matter of weeks.
In a column for WorldNetDaily, Middle East analyst Laura Mansfield said she believes the letter could be a "last warning."
Mansfield says the question must be asked: "Why deliver such a letter when there is little chance it will result in policy changes for either country?"
Like Spencer and Adams, she points out: "Islamic theology documents that no attack can be carried out in jihad without first offering the 'unbelievers' the opportunity to 'repent' and accept Islam. Only when that overture is rejected can an attack occur." ....... http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=50146
Richmond: GM teams race quotes http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=216821&FS=NASCAR-CUP
Richmond: Dodge teams race quotes http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=216820&FS=NASCAR-CUP
Richmond: Ford teams race quotes http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=216819&FS=NASCAR-CUP
NHRA POWERade Drag Racing Series Top Fuel points leader Melanie Troxel became the first woman in the 40-year history of the Driver of the Year award to win the quarterly title in voting by a panel of leading journalists and broadcasters. The 33-year-old driver of the Skull Shine/Torco Race Fuels Top Fuel dragster impressed the voters as well as her rivals as she made all five final-round appearances in the quarter and took victories in Pomona and Las Vegas in her first full season........ http://www.nhra.com/apcm/templates/news_template.asp?articleid=12117&zoneid=8
POWERade Top Fuel point leader Melanie Troxel and her husband Tommy Johnson Jr., who drives a Funny Car, will be featured on the popular national network news show CBS Sunday Morning with host Charles Osgood, at 9 a.m. ET this Sunday, May 14.
Troxel, who drives the Skull Shine/Torco Race Fuels Top Fuel dragster for Don Schumacher Racing, and Johnson, the driver of Don "the Snake" Prudhomme's Skoal Monte Carlo, were interviewed at length last weekend at the Southern Nationals at Atlanta Dragway by CBS correspondent Susan Spencer...... http://www.nhra.com/apcm/templates/news_template.asp?articleid=12322&zoneid=8
What do you do if your dad is the winningest driver in drag racing history? You race, even if you are a woman! Ashley Force, one of four daughters of the 13-time national champion Funny Car driver John Force, is launching her own racing career in style. In 2005 she won a national series championship with an injected-nitro Top Alcohol Dragster (TAD). And her aspiration? To race against her famous dad in a Funny Car......... http://www.motorsport.com/magazine/feature.asp?C=WhosWho&D=2006-05-02
Congress wants to change the Internet.
This is news to most people because the major news media have not actively pursued the story. Yet both the House and Senate commerce committees are promoting new rules governing the manner by which most Americans receive the Web. Congressional passage of new rules is widely anticipated, as is President Bush's signature. Once this happens, the Internet will change before your eyes........ http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/opinion/oped/bal-op.internet09may09%2C0%2C4559120.story
PORTLAND, Ore - Most adults can remember the carefree days of childhood, climbing trees and jumping from swings, often on schoolyard playgrounds. Climbing, swinging and sliding was once a rite of passage during recess, a time for adventure, to see how high, how far and how fast we could go as a kid. Today, kids find themselves grounded, victims of a culture of fear and injury litigation. A growing number of school districts are going so far as to ban the game of tag and are even posting signs that read "no running on the playground." Is there real danger on the modern playground? Safety advocates say yes and want to eliminate it. Their first target: swing sets......... http://www.katu.com/stories/85715.html
LONDON – Britain's secret intelligence service, MI6, has established the first proof al-Qaida is playing a major role in the new Cold War between North and South America – with Osama bin Laden's terror network seeing itself in league with Mexican subversives in infiltrating the U.S. border...... http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=50130
The U.S. Border Patrol is tipping off Mexican authorities on the positions of members of the Minuteman civilian patrols....."Now we know why it seemed like Mexican officials knew where we were all the time," Chris Simcox, founder of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps, told the Ontario paper. "It's unbelievable that our own government agency is sending intelligence to another country," he said. "They are sending intelligence to a nation where corruption runs rampant, and that could be getting into the hands of criminal cartels. "They just basically endangered the lives of American people.".......
Border agents interviewed by the paper said they have been asked to report the location of all civilian patrols to sector headquarters. But they are not to file the groups' names in reports if they spot illegal immigrants.
"Last year an internal memo notified all agents not to give credit to Minuteman volunteers or others who call in sightings of illegal aliens," said an agent who spoke to the Daily Bulletin on condition he not be identified. "We were told to list it as a citizen call and leave it at that. Many times, we were told not to go out to Minuteman calls." http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=50122
Andy Ramirez, the chairman of a non-profit organization supporting the U.S. Border Patrol, describes the perilous situation along the U.S.-Mexico border. Andy Ramirez serves as chairman of Friends of the Border Patrol (FBP), a non-profit organization that was created to support the U.S. Border Patrol and defend U.S. national security. Founded in 2004, FBP works with the Border Patrol and law enforcement officials across the United States and is using surveillance cameras on the U.S.-Mexico border to serve as a "neighborhood watch" and as "eyes and ears" for the Border Patrol in high-traffic areas where the Border Patrol does not have cameras operating. With his many contacts in the Border Patrol, Mr. Ramirez also breaks important stories that have been neglected or covered up by the politicians and the major media......... http://www.thenewamerican.com/artman/publish/article_3786.shtml
The new film, Sophie Scholl: The Final Days, Germany’s 2005 Oscar nominee for best foreign language film, recounts this fateful event and the interrogation, trial and executions that followed within 72 hours. This is not the first movie about the anti-Nazi heroine. Two other German films, The White Rose and Five Last Days (both 1982), also covered the same subject. However, this latest treatment is the first to benefit from court transcripts uncovered in East Germany in 1990.
The portrait that emerges is that of a young, middle class woman of strong religious beliefs, committed to the classical liberal ideals of freedom of speech, freedom of belief and the universal value of human life. But we also see she has a boyfriend and loves jazz and Schubert. Clearly this is no fanatic eager for martyrdom. When she is taken to police headquarters for questioning, she denies having anything to do with printing or distributing the seditious pamphlets. She acknowledges only the act of pushing a stack of them off a ledge -- which, she says, was just an expression of her impish nature. She convincingly explains away the empty suitcase (she was on her way back home to Ulm to pick up clean laundry) and what she was doing in the empty corridor (waiting to speak to a friend in class).
Only after police discover incriminating evidence in her apartment and exact her brother’s confession does Sophie admit to acts of treason. Suddenly, she abandons the alibi and embraces her civil disobedience without apology.
At this critical point, the suspense that has been building is released -- we know her prospect is hopeless. But something even more provocative takes over. What we get in the second half of the film is a rarity in moviemaking: a dialogue of ideas between Sophie and her captors. That those arguing against her are puppets of the regime makes her case no less spirited or persuasive.
When the police inspector tells her, “The law protects order,” Sophie replies, “People are imprisoned for speaking freely. Is that order?”
When the inspector calls her a child who was not brought up properly, she responds, “You think I wasn’t raised right because I feel pity for killing mentally ill children?”
In Julia Jentsch’s remarkable performance, Sophie’s passion burns not as a wildfire but as a votive candle of hope. In her is an abiding sense of a higher justice and loyalty to country above government. In the clutches of the Gestapo and isolated from her companions, she does not waver from principle nor retreat from what a patriot of another land called “the great responsibility which we hold to God and our country.”
One of her leaflets had promised, “We will not be silent. We are your bad conscience. The White Rose will not leave you in peace!” Even in the face of death, Sophie keeps her word. When the Goebbels-like presiding judge pronounces her sentence, Sophie calmly answers, “You'll soon be standing where I am now.”
From the Freedom Daily, January 1996.
The White Rose: A Lesson in Dissent by Jacob G. Hornberger, January 1996
This is the story of The White Rose. It is a lesson in dissent. It is a tale of courage--of principle--of honor. It is detailed in three books: The White Rose (1970) by Inge Scholl, A Noble Treason (1979) by Richard Hanser, and An Honourable Defeat (1994) by Anton Gill.
Hans and Sophie Scholl were German teenagers in the 1930s. Like other young Germans, they enthusiastically joined the Hitler Youth. They believed that Adolf Hitler was leading Germany and the German people back to greatness.
Their parents were not so enthusiastic. Their father--Robert Scholl--told his children that Hitler and the Nazis were leading Germany down a road of destruction. Later--in 1942--he would serve time in a Nazi prison for telling his secretary: "The war! It is already lost. This Hitler is God's scourge on mankind, and if the war doesn't end soon the Russians will be sitting in Berlin."
Gradually, Hans and Sophie began realizing that their father was right. They concluded that, in the name of freedom and the greater good of the German nation, Hitler and the Nazis were enslaving and destroying the German people.
They also knew that open dissent was impossible in Nazi Germany, especially after the start of World War II. Most Germans took the traditional position-that once war breaks out, it is the duty of the citizen to support the troops by supporting the government.
But Hans and Sophie Scholl believed differently. They believed that it was the duty of a citizen, even in times of war, to stand up against an evil regime, especially when it is sending hundreds of thousands of its citizens to their deaths.
The Scholl siblings began sharing their feelings with a few of their friends--Christoph Probst, Alexander Schmorell, Willi Graf--as well as with Kurt Huber, their psychology and philosophy professor.
One day in 1942, copies of a leaflet entitled "The White Rose" suddenly appeared at the University of Munich. The leaflet contained an anonymous essay that said that the Nazi system had slowly imprisoned the German people and was now destroying them. The Nazi regime had turned evil. It was time, the essay said, for Germans to rise up and resist the tyranny of their own government. At the bottom of the essay, the following request appeared: "Please make as many copies of this leaflet as you can and distribute them."
The leaflet caused a tremendous stir among the student body. It was the first time that internal dissent against the Nazi regime had surfaced in Germany. The essay had been secretly written and distributed by Hans Scholl and his friends.
Another leaflet appeared soon afterward. And then another. And another. Ultimately, there were six leaflets published and distributed by Hans and Sophie Scholl and their friends--four under the title "The White Rose" and two under the title "Leaflets of the Resistance." Their publication took place periodically between 1942 and 1943--interrupted for a few months when Hans and his friends were temporarily sent to the Eastern Front to fight against the Russians.
The members of The White Rose, of course, had to act cautiously. The Nazi regime maintained an iron grip over German society. Internal dissent was quickly and efficiently smashed by the Gestapo. Hans and Sophie Scholl and their friends knew what would happen to them if they were caught.
People began receiving copies of the leaflets in the mail. Students at the University of Hamburg began copying and distributing them. Copies began turning up in different parts of Germany and Austria.
Moreover, as Hanser points out, the members of The White Rose did not limit themselves to leaflets. Graffiti began appearing in large letters on streets and buildings all over Munich: "Down with Hitler! . . . Hitler the Mass Murderer!" and "Freihart!
. . . Freihart! . . . Freedom! . . . Freedom!"
The Gestapo was driven into a frenzy. It knew that the authors were having to procure large quantities of paper, envelopes, and postage. It knew that they were using a duplicating machine. But despite the Gestapo's best efforts, it was unable to catch the perpetrators.
One day--February 18, 1943--Hans' and Sophie's luck ran out. They were caught leaving pamphlets at the University of Munich and were arrested. A search disclosed evidence of Christoph Probst's participation, and he too was soon arrested. The three of them were indicted for treason.
On February 22--four days after their arrest--their trial began. The presiding judge, Roland Freisler, chief justice of the People's Court of the Greater German Reich, had been sent from Berlin. Hanser writes:
"He conducted the trial as if the future of the Reich were indeed at stake. He roared denunciations of the accused as if he were not the judge but the prosecutor. He behaved alternately like an actor ranting through an overwritten role in an implausible melodrama and a Grand Inquisitor calling down eternal damnation on the heads of the three irredeemable heretics before him. . . . No witnesses were called, since the defendants had admitted everything. The proceedings consisted almost entirely of Roland Freisler's denunciation and abuse, punctuated from time to time by half-hearted offerings from the court-appointed defense attorneys, one of whom summed up his case with the observation, "I can only say fiat justitia . Let justice be done." By which he meant: Let the accused get what they deserve.
Freisler and the other accusers could not understand what had happened to these German youths. After all, they all came from nice German families. They all had attended German schools. They had been members of the Hitler Youth. How could they have turned out to be traitors? What had so twisted and warped their minds?
Sophie Scholl shocked everyone in the courtroom when she remarked to Freisler: "Somebody, after all, had to make a start. What we wrote and said is also believed by many others. They just don't dare to express themselves as we did." Later in the proceedings, she said to him: "You know the war is lost. Why don't you have the courage to face it?"
In the middle of the trial, Robert and Magdalene Scholl tried to enter the courtroom. Magdalene said to the guard: "But I'm the mother of two of the accused." The guard responded: "You should have brought them up better." Robert Scholl forced his way into the courtroom and told the court that he was there to defend his children. He was seized and forcibly escorted outside. The entire courtroom heard him shout: "One day there will be another kind of justice! One day they will go down in history!"
Robert Freisler pronounced his judgment on the three defendants: Guilty of treason. Their sentence: Death.
They were escorted back to Stadelheim prison, where the guards permitted Hans and Sophie to have one last visit with their parents. Hans met with them first, and then Sophie. Hansen writes:
"His eyes were clear and steady and he showed no sign of dejection or despair. He thanked his parents again for the love and warmth they had given him and he asked them to convey his affection and regard to a number of friends, whom he named. Here, for a moment, tears threatened, and he turned away to spare his parents the pain of seeing them. Facing them again, his shoulders were back and he smiled. . . .
"Then a woman prison guard brought in Sophie. . . . Her mother tentatively offered her some candy, which Hans had declined. "Gladly," said Sophie, taking it. "After all, I haven't had any lunch!" She, too, looked somehow smaller, as if drawn together, but her face was clear and her smile was fresh and unforced, with something in it that her parents read as triumph. "Sophie, Sophie," her mother murmured, as if to herself. "To think you'll never be coming through the door again!" Sophie's smile was gentle. "Ah, Mother," she said. "Those few little years. . . ." Sophie Scholl looked at her parents and was strong in her pride and certainty. "We took everything upon ourselves," she said. "What we did will cause waves." Her mother spoke again: "Sophie," she said softly, "Remember Jesus." "Yes," replied Sophie earnestly, almost commandingly, "but you, too." She left them, her parents, Robert and Magdalene Scholl, with her face still lit by the smile they loved so well and would never see again. She was perfectly composed as she was led away. Robert Mohr [a Gestapo official], who had come out to the prison on business of his own, saw her in her cell immediately afterwards, and she was crying. It was the first time Robert Mohr had seen her in tears, and she apologized. "I have just said good-bye to my parents," she said. "You understand . . ." She had not cried before her parents. For them she had smiled."
No relatives visited Christoph Probst. His wife, who had just had their third child, was in the hospital. Neither she nor any members of his family even knew that he was on trial or that he had been sentenced to death. While his faith in God had always been deep and unwavering, he had never committed to a certain faith. On the eve of his death, a Catholic priest admitted him into the church in articulo mortis --at the point of death. "Now," he said, "my death will be easy and joyful."
That afternoon, the prison guards permitted Hans, Sophie, and Christoph to have one last visit together. Sophie was then led to the guillotine. One observer described her as she walked to her death: "Without turning a hair, without flinching." Christoph Probst was next. Hans Scholl was last; just before he was beheaded, Hans cried out:
"LONG LIVE FREEDOM!"
Unfortunately, they were not the last to die. The Gestapo's investigation was relentless. Later tried and executed were Alex Schmorell (age 25), Willi Graf (age 25), and Kurt Huber (age 49). Students at the University of Hamburg were either executed or sent to concentration camps.
Today, every German knows the story of The White Rose. A square at the University of Munich is named after Hans and Sophie Scholl. And there are streets, squares, and schools all over Germany named for the members of The White Rose. The German movie The White Rose is now found in video stores in Germany and the United States.
Richard Hansen sums up the story of The White Rose:
"In the vogue words of the time, the Scholls and their friends represented the "other" Germany, the land of poets and thinkers, in contrast to the Germany that was reverting to barbarism and trying to take the world with it. What they were and what they did would have been "other" in any society at any time. What they did transcended the easy division of good-German/bad-German and lifted them above the nationalism of time--bound events. Their actions made them enduring symbols of the struggle, universal and timeless, for the freedom of the human spirit wherever and whenever it is threatened. " http://www.fff.org/freedom/0196a.asp "There is an ultimate limit to formal legality beyond which it becomes invalid and immoral. That is when it becomes a cover for the cowardice that does not dare to stand up against the injustices of the state." - Kurt Huber.
A great site to see and learn more about these couragous individuals who should never be forgotten. http://www.jlrweb.com/whiterose/
Excerpts from a series of essays written and distributed in Nazi Germany by Hans and Sophie Scholl and other German students in 1942 and 1943. http://www.fff.org/freedom/0196e.asp
http://www.fff.org/comment/ed1201a.asp
Replies:
Reply author: Horseless Carriage
Replied on: 02/07/2006 3:35:43 PM
Message: 
Right Coast Racers
 Martin Maniacs 
  BEvERS  
   POF   
Reply author: Horseless Carriage
Replied on: 02/07/2006 3:37:40 PM
Message: They just had to say Cherry, huh?
Right Coast Racers
 Martin Maniacs 
  BEvERS  
   POF   
Reply author: Tuner Racing
Replied on: 02/15/2006 4:39:51 PM
Message: Darn Drafters as you Know I have stated many times before that I read 99% of your posting with interest, but I guess you finally figured on a way to make me post a comment.................LOONEY TUNES in the article..............LOL..........You Got me this time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tuner
POF PIT BOX~~~~JUST FOR SHEER ENJOYMENTPOF Gaming Inc. ™
MIDWEST FANS---RCR---Martin Maniacs---Cutie Pie---Tony's Smokehouse---Junior Rocks *********Flippin Over #99*********---LAST CALL--- JOHNSONS~~~~~~BEVERS DEN~~~~~~ Home of OöO Multiple O's OöO™
http://www.1-2-free-forums.com/mf/?mforum=chevy57 In Memory of SPEED, And Cal "Godspeed Wayne & Cal"
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 02/15/2006 4:44:10 PM
Message: quote: Originally posted by Tuner Racing
Darn Drafters as you Know I have stated many times before that I read 99% of your posting with interest, but I guess you finally figured on a way to make me post a comment.................LOONEY TUNES in the article..............LOL..........You Got me this time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Tuner
POF PIT BOX~~~~JUST FOR SHEER ENJOYMENTPOF Gaming Inc. ™
MIDWEST FANS---RCR---Martin Maniacs---Cutie Pie---Tony's Smokehouse---Junior Rocks *********Flippin Over #99*********---LAST CALL--- JOHNSONS~~~~~~BEVERS DEN~~~~~~ Home of OöO Multiple O's OöO™
http://www.1-2-free-forums.com/mf/?mforum=chevy57 In Memory of SPEED, And Cal "Godspeed Wayne & Cal"
I thought that might get your attention.
BFG <> West CoastReloaded~*~* de la Chica Pie'S ~*~#9~
Spook Inc. ®
Reply author: D.D.D.D.C.
Replied on: 02/16/2006 6:58:53 PM
Message:    I drink Tilt frm budwiser all the time it is awesum!!! U can actually pass out with a Hard On!!! gee go figure
Reply author: Twister Racing
Replied on: 02/22/2006 12:16:44 PM
Message: hey hey now  
DuPont Machine 24
BFG  NASCARSOUTH
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 02/22/2006 12:36:37 PM
Message: Twister, you having a problem with the fishing off the back of a giraffe or is it the sheep thing? I don't understand why you folks in Oklahoma can have the front legs of farm animals in you boots but not the hind legs? Does this apply to shoes and how do you define farm animal? Are you folks in Oklahoma hind legaphobes?
BFG <> West CoastReloaded~*~* de la Chica Pie'S ~*~#9~
Spook Inc. ®
Reply author: bruskiracing
Replied on: 02/22/2006 4:05:29 PM
Message: quote: Originally posted by Drafters
Real Laws Arizona – when being attacked by a criminal or burglar, you may only protect yourself with the same weapon that the other person possesses.
I think winning a game of ROCK, PAPER, SCISSORS could be illegal too, (using a superior weapon again) Seattle, Washington – you may not carry a concealed weapon that is over six feet in length. Washington – it is mandatory for a motorist with criminal intentions to stop at the city limits and telephone the chief of police as he is entering the town.
Drafters, no more hiding those SS-20's in your pants especially without phoning ahead first West Virginia – roadkill may be taken home for supper.
Jim McCormick had better take care before traveling to WV.
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 02/22/2006 4:34:44 PM
Message: "it is mandatory for a motorist with criminal intentions to stop at the city limits and telephone the chief of police as he is entering the town."
What kind of drugs the are law makers taking when they come up with these laws?
I still wanna know what the deal is with farm animal legs in boots. Twister? Sis?
BFG <> West CoastReloaded~*~* de la Chica Pie'S ~*~#9~
Spook Inc. ®
Reply author: Slipry Bob
Replied on: 02/22/2006 4:43:16 PM
Message: Location: Acworth, Georgia All citizens must own a rake. This law still exists.
Location: Acworth, Georgia One man may not be on another man's back.    This law still exists.
BFG West Coast Reloaded Spook Inc. ®
Reply author: Twister Racing
Replied on: 02/27/2006 4:07:07 PM
Message:  quote: Originally posted by Drafters
Twister, you having a problem with the fishing off the back of a giraffe or is it the sheep thing? I don't understand why you folks in Oklahoma can have the front legs of farm animals in you boots but not the hind legs? Does this apply to shoes and how do you define farm animal? Are you folks in Oklahoma hind legaphobes?
BFG <> West CoastReloaded~*~* de la Chica Pie'S ~*~#9~
Spook Inc. ®
LMAO---just now noticed your comment there Drafterman. Just laughing right now. Don't have a comment as of the moment. Give me nudder drink or 2.
DuPont Machine 24
BFG  NASCARSOUTH
Reply author: Twister Racing
Replied on: 02/27/2006 5:27:53 PM
Message: Well let's C. If their front legs are in your boots, which I don't wear boots, you woooood get the Angelique(or however u spell it, u know the 1 with the LIPS) effect.  With the hind legs u would probably get the Elton John effect.  I would guess. Darn sure don't know for sure. Don't even know anyone I could ask.
So that would be the guess for the week Draftersssman. 
DuPont Machine 24
BFG  NASCARSOUTH
Reply author: Pushy Loose Racing
Replied on: 03/03/2006 10:23:08 AM
Message: quote: Originally posted by Drafters
NARRAGANSETT, R.I. – The eruption started modestly. On April 5, 1815, after two years of puffs and burps, Mt. Tambora launched a thick column of ash, pumice, and gas into the sky. For people living near the foot of the massive Indonesian volcano, the view was spectacular, but the fallout was merely a nuisance - good for the soil. Five days later, however, in the early evening, Tambora exploded in the largest volcanic eruption in history. For the first three hours, ash and dust hurtled into the sky in a roiling cloud some 26 miles tall. Then, much of the cloud collapsed back onto the mountain, sending a thick, searing avalanche of ash, dust, and rock tumbling down the slopes at Autobahn speeds, burying everything in its path.......... http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0302/p14s03-sten.html
You know Drafters....That brought on "the year without a summer". Crops failed globally from that event. Many regions in the Northern Hemishere received snow in July. The civilazation where the volcano was located all perished. The Caldera left behind after she popped was 4 miles wide! The tonage of material that was belched into the atmosphere was enormous at an estimated 100 cubic km of melted rock, weighing approximately 2-3 × 10(to the 14th power) kg (That is a Monster number  ). The exact death toll is unknown because globally hundreds of thousands staved to death from lack of food.   
From the Web:
Mount Tambora is a stratovolcano on the Indonesian island of Sumbawa. In 1815, the volcano of Tambora suffered the most violent eruption in modern times. Beginning in early April and continuing through the middle of July, its explosion affected an immense area that included the Maluku Islands (Molucca Islands), Java, and portions of Sulawesi (Celebes), Sumatra, and Borneo. Heavy ash rains also specifically affected the islands of Bali and Lombok. Approximately 92,000 people were killed because of Pyroclastic flows or starvation and disease. 1816 became known as "the Year Without a Summer" because of the extreme weather conditions the eruption caused.
DuPont Machine 24
BFG RULES NASCARSOUTH
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 03/03/2006 11:40:24 AM
Message: Pushy Loose, somewhere in the Northeast U.S. is a monument for a farmer in that area who saved the town's residents from starving during the year without a summer. If I remember the story correctly he had a high land wheat farm that enabled him to grow enough wheat during the shortened growing season to feed the town.
BFG <> West CoastReloaded~*~* de la Chica Pie'S ~*~#9~
Spook Inc. ®
Reply author: Pushy Loose Racing
Replied on: 03/04/2006 10:29:41 AM
Message: Reuben Whitten shared his wheat crop with his neighbors.
http://werme.8m.net/1816.html
DuPont Machine 24
BFG RULES NASCARSOUTH
Reply author: bruskiracing
Replied on: 03/07/2006 2:59:59 PM
Message: Knowing your prediliction for cheerleaders, I'm suprized not to have seen you report on the cheerleader who kept on cheering after falling from top of a pyramid 15 feet on her head and breaking her neck.
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 03/07/2006 3:25:36 PM
Message: This was getting to be a real problem so I joined Cheerleaders Anonymous.
BFG <> West CoastReloaded~*~* de la Chica Pie'S ~*~#9~
Spook Inc. ®
Reply author: Axis Of Evil
Replied on: 03/24/2006 4:52:02 PM
Message: I see no problem with looking at worst-case scenarios when dealing with the future of humanity. Those that proclaim that belching millions of tons of gases into the atmoshere continually has no effect are normally the ones profiting from such activity. What we do know is that the ice sheets reflect 90% of the sun's energy and the ocean's surface absorbs 90%. We'd have one hell of a swing in teperatures if the ice were to significantly retreat. Here's to hoping they aren't.
Also, why is anyone suggesting limitations on capitalism considered a traitor? Any educated person knows that pure capitalism does not work, just like pure communism does not work. The answer lies somewhere in between. We scoff at someone for suggesting that we have enough development in the USA, yet we freak out when they want to build a power plant, waste dump or anything of the like in our backyards. You can't have it both ways. Without resistance, our nation would be one big strip mall and a massive suburbia. Roosevelt had many opponents to creating national parks, just like industry constantly refuses to acknowledge that they just may have an effect on the world around them. 30 years ago industry just dumped their chemicals and waste right into lakes and rivers and it was magically "gone." Now that there are people that stand up to such callous practices they are labelled extremists and "wackos." When practices and behaviors are indefensible then go on the offensive and destroy the credibility of the accusers. That has pretty much been the game plan for the far-right and the huge money interests since the beginning of the environmental movement. Perhaps there are such extremists in the movement because the resistance to their cause is financed by "all the money in the world?"
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 03/24/2006 5:25:56 PM
Message: No Axis, the people that stand up to such callous practices are not the extremists or wackos. The extremists and wackos are the ones who will not settle for a middle ground rooted in real science or facts and the ones who think mankind is a blight on the earth and whom should be eradicated. A lot of these extremists are not really interested in saving the environment, they're only interested in pushing their philosophical agenda and a good example would be a local leader of the Seirra Club. In a nutshell, before the Seirra Club was able to help get many logging operations stopped in the Pacific Northwest the head of the local Sierra Club had all the trees on his acerage cut down before the tree cutting laws and polices were passed.
"Phasing out the human race will solve every problem on earth, social and environmental." - Dave Forman, founder of Earth First, and presently a member of the Board of Directors for the Sierra Club.
BFG <> West CoastReloaded~*~* de la Chica Pie'S ~*~#9~
Spook Inc. ®
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 03/24/2006 5:43:47 PM
Message: ...."The enormous problems we have with pollution are a result of the fact that the courts have historically failed to protect private property from pollution. Over a hundred years ago, when polluters were first being sued for the damage they were causing, instead of protecting the victims of pollution, the courts ruled in favor of allowing the polluters to continue to pollute, arguing that the jobs and economic benefits associated with the polluting factory outweighed the damage of the pollution. If the courts had instead sided with the victims of the pollution, the polluters would have had either to stop polluting or to negotiate with the victims for compensation for a particular level of pollution. This would have set the stage for direct economic incentives to invest in the research and development of pollution — free manufacturing and pollution-reduction technology. Instead, the courts' failure to protect private-property rights resulted in a situation in which any company which spent money to reduce or eliminate pollution would be at a competitive disadvantage to those companies which treated the environment as a zero-cost waste dump. The result is the pollution on a vast scale which we see today.".....
http://www.fff.org/freedom/0593d.asp
....While most of their moderate contemporaries grew up to become our architects, accountants, and automobile dealers, a small cadre—the Rousseauian residue of the Woodstock Generation—never outgrew their fundamental cultural alienation and hostility. They never developed the slightest interest in the basic values accepted by most people. For 20 years, they have been seething on the fringes of society. Now, like scavengers scenting a wounded animal, they are closing in on a vulnerable culture.
This small group of fanatics sets the moral premises of today’s environmentalist movement. Contrary to the beliefs of many decent people who call themselves “environmentalists” and even of most of those who join environmental groups, the leadership cadre is not primarily interested in clean air, land, and water, in abundant resources, or in resolving disputed claims to their use. They have a far different agenda..... http://www.fee.org/publications/the-freeman/article.asp?aid=1210
BFG <> West CoastReloaded~*~* de la Chica Pie'S ~*~#9~
Spook Inc. ®
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 03/25/2006 12:41:18 PM
Message: .....Some readers may recall the sight of flames leaping from the Cuyahoga River in Cleveland in 1969. An oil slick on the river caught fire, which lit wooden train trusses. There had been fires in the river before; the Cuyahoga, an industrial sewer, was biologically dead. A few years before the fire, a real estate company had sued the city for allowing the river to deteriorate to such a condition. The trial court ordered the city to investigate the causes of the pollution and ordered “such nuisances . . . to be abated.” The supreme court of Ohio reversed, holding that the river was under the control of state authorities. Common-law protection had been erased by the Ohio Water Pollution Control Board, which had granted permission for various industries to discharge wastes into the Cuyahoga and, thereby, Lake Erie. When regulation takes precedence over common-law rights, the result can be destructive to the environment.......
The granddaddy of all Superfund sites is Love Canal. In 1980 it generated horror stories of chemicals seeping from an abandoned toxic dump site run by Hooker Chemical Company (Occidental Petroleum). Publicity about the site helped spur public support for quick passage of the Superfund toxic-cleanup law, the Carter administration’s final major “gift” to citizens before leaving office.
Love Canal was a failed entrepreneurial canal built in the 1800s. In 1941, Hooker Chemical bought the 3,000-foot long trough, which was 8 to 16 feet deep and 60 to 80 feet wide, to use to dump toxic waste from its plant on the outskirts of the City of Niagara Falls, New York. The canal soil was hard clay, so it made an excellent disposal site that did not appear to cause water contamination. In the 1950s, the city, which had been fully informed of what was under the soil, essentially condemned the Love Canal property and, over company objections, later built a public school on the grounds and allowed housing to be constructed there. Eventually, Hooker had to pay to clean up the site under the Superfund law.
Hooker was also sued in tort by citizens and various governments. The federal court judge in 1994 provided exhaustive findings in the case U.S. v. Hooker Chemical. The government requested punitive damages from Hooker, but the court rejected the request. Nevertheless, Hooker was held negligent, primarily for not coming forward with more information about the dangers of various chemicals in later years. “While the Company should have made greater efforts to keep local residents off the property,” the judge ruled, “it violated . . . no legal obligation in failing to do so. It responded to complaints about odors, fires, and exposures to chemicals whenever notified, and there was no evidence of injury during the disposal operations that would have signaled a compelling need to provide more protection.”
Love Canal is notorious. One environmental law textbook asserts that hundreds of people suffered terrible injuries there. No doubt the hysteria caused by EPA workers in space suits hustling people from their homes may have caused distress. Yet the court’s review of injuries from chemical exposure shows only “relatively minor noticeable injury.” That is, the Love Canal Superfund site, the stuff of environmental legends, was found, on careful examination, to be associated with little harm to human beings at the time and no lasting harm. But the company was liable for what minor harms it negligently inflicted on residents. No harm at all would have likely ever occurred had the city not demanded the property from the company and built on it, tampering with the soil cover on the chemicals.
These horror stories, the stuff of the Green Scare, have achieved the status of Official Truth. But each is grossly distorted in the service of interventionist environmentalism. Here’s yet another example of the old saying that it’s not what we don’t know that hurts us. It’s what we know that isn’t so. http://www.fee.org/publications/the-freeman/article.asp?aid=4171
Escalating a campaign questioning Vice President Al Gore's environmental commitment, environmental organizations today placed a full-page ad in the west coast edition of the New York Times. The ad, whose headline reads "Who is Al Gore? Environmental Champion or Petroleum Politician? The U'wa people need to know" substantiates Gore's connections to Occidental Petroleum and argues that the Vice President has a specific responsibility to act on behalf of the U'wa people.......
Gore has enjoyed the corporate sponsorship of Oxy throughout his political career. He controls up to $500,000 in Oxy stocks and has received $20,000 a year for almost 30 years from mining rights to his land that Oxy never mined. Gore's father made a great deal of his wealth while working for Oxy and its ex-chairman, Armand Hammer. Gore Sr. sat on the Board of Oxy for twenty-eight years. Since Gore was elected Vice President, Oxy Chairman Ray Irani has given more than $400,000 to the Democratic Party.
Furthermore, a Gore initiative,"Reinventing Government" resulted in the sale of the Elk Hills Naval Petroleum Reserve to Occidental in 1998. The unprecedented closed bidding process was the largest privatization of federal property in U.S. history, one that tripled Occidental's U.S. oil reserves overnight......
http://www.corpwatch.org/article.php?id=259
BFG <> West CoastReloaded~*~* de la Chica Pie'S ~*~#9~
Spook Inc. ®
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 03/30/2006 4:55:52 PM
Message: Axis, I watched a good show last night on the National Geographic channel about climate change. Honest science shows that earth has a long history of climate change, some of it quite rapid, and the past 10,000 years of somewhat consistant climate since the last ice age ended is "abnormal." We are in what they called an inter-glacial period and if I heard them right a number of honest scientests are saying we will be in another ice age within the next 20 to 100 years. This also fits in with something I read a while back about how scientests studying earths past climate have determined that at times the water temperature of the oceans has been as high as 107 degrees F.
You might want to start buying warm clothes before the rush starts.
Reply author: Axis Of Evil
Replied on: 04/05/2006 3:43:53 PM
Message: A study by the U.S. Navy has concluded that we may very likely see the disappearance of the arctic summer ice cover by 2050. Other reputable scientists forecast the "shutting down" of the heat driven ocean circulation currents. A short-term global warming will eventually result in extremely cold temperatures and a mass die-off of the human population.
As far as buying warm clothing before the rush, let me remind you that I have plenty since I live downwind of lake Ontario. The temperatures get very cold and we see record snowfalls quite often.
It's too bad that having concern over man's effect on the environment gets one labelled a "wacko" or extremist. It seems the corporate view of our global climate impact is that of an ostrich sticking it's head in the sand. (Ostriches do this to find water I believe, but in this instance I am referencing the stereotypical reason as to why they do this) Corporations don't want to know anything and unless there is hard scientific facts, speculation and prevention are simply out of the question.
Goerge Bush said that American's have a God-given right to consume oil as they wish. Five years later he now claims we are addicted to oil and must change. Which is it?
I'm not against industry and development, but I am against the complete dismissal by the far right-wing of any study and theory about climatic changes. They consider it nonsense, partisan and an attack on American values, this from the party that preaches responsibility.
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 04/05/2006 4:20:38 PM
Message: Once again let me say not all environmentalists are wackos or extremists.
The scientific facts are the global temperature has been warming for over 10,000 years and the earth has gone through many warming and cooling cycles throughout its history and it will continue to do so regardless of what mankind does or doesn't do. Also, there are more scientest who say they don't believe mankind is responsible for global warming then there are who say mankind is responsible. Lastly, Mars is experiancing global warming also and I don't think there is any way mankind can be blamed for that. It could be the suns output, which is not constant, has increased over the past centuries. If you think global warming is a problem now just wait till the sun turns into a red giant and consumes the earth. Buy your sun block now! 
From The Seattle Times, 7-16-96, page B4, by Times editorial columnist Michelle Malkin:
...Between 1881 and 1993, the earth warmed roughly 0.54 degrees Celsius. But nearly 70 percent of that warming occurred during the first half of the century - that is, prior to World War II and long before the most dramatic increase in greenhouse gases took place... ...a 1991 Gallup poll of 400 randomly selected members of the American Meteorological Society and the American Geophysical Union showed that only one in three attributed the increases to human activities... There are those who argue that "better safe then sorry" is always the most prudent course of action. But prudence cannot be purchased for free...Buying into drastic remedies for the man-made global warming apocalypse, in other words, may give us a little peace of mind now - but it may also cost our children's children dearly later... end quote
Here is a little something on the ozone hole scare, which was a fraud.
In 1995 I did a little bit of research on the ozone hole over Antarctica and made an interesting discovery. I looked at some data from either NOAA or NASA on ozone measurements over Antarctica for 1993, and the lowest measurement that year showed an ozone level of about 130 dobson units. However, in the late 1950s, when the ozone hole was first discovered, the lowest measurement taken showed an ozone level of 120 dobson units. Despite what the environmentalists would have you believe, not only was the ozone hole discovered 30 years earlier then is commonly thought, the amount of ozone over Antarctica has not decreased but does show a small increase!
From the book Ecoscam by Ronald Bailey, c1993, pages 134, & 135: "...In August 1991, Guy Brasseur predicted 'a substantial ozone decrease especially in the mid- and high-latitudes, and especially in winter.' He predicted wintertime ozone losses due to the volcano (Mt. Pinatubo) of up to 15 percent...So when NASA created a Northern Hemisphere ozone hole scare, it wasn't exactly a secret that the ozone layer might become a bit frayed in 1992...University of Virginia environmental scientist Fred Singer points out that Sir. M. B. Dobson, the inventor of the machine that measures ozone, reported very low ozone values-only 150 Dobson units-over Halley Bay, Antarctica, in 1956 and 1957. (By contrast, in the 1960s and 1970s the level was over 300 Dobson units.) Two French scientists recently republished data showing pronounced ozone decreases, down to 120 Dobson units, during the Antarctic spring in 1958. These measurements were taken years before CFCs could have caused any such decline." end quote
"In March 1992, meteorologists Dirk De Muer and his colleagues at the Belgian Meteorological Institute published a study showing that the instruments used to measure ozone have probably mistaken reductions in atmospheric sulfur dioxide (due to air pollution controls) for declines in gobal ozone. The reduced sulfer dioxide, they wrote, "has induced a fictitious Dobson total ozone trend of -1.69% per decade." The researchers found that, once the sulfur dioxide trends were taken into account, there appears to be a small UPWARD trend in global ozone....." "I couldn't understand why NASA didn't come out and say this could be a very unusual year because of the volcanic eruptions...," mused David Hofmann, an ozone expert at NOAA. "Instead, they seemed to imply that this is the start of something really big. That really wasn't very wise. If there's a major ozone depletion seen this year, it's quite likely that it is realated to the volcano." Of course, Hofmann failed to factor in NASA's budget considerations." -Ecoscam: The False Prophets of Ecological Apocalypse, by Ronald Bailey
Reply author: T&L Wheelock Racing
Replied on: 04/05/2006 4:30:16 PM
Message: and not all loggers... development companies, construction folk, etc are bad folk either..
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 04/05/2006 4:38:22 PM
Message: When I talk about wacko or extremist environmentalists this is what I'm talking about.
From The Seattle Times, 3-25-96, page B1, by Alex Tizon and Dee Norton: No sea lions were hunted by authorities at the Ballard Locks today, due to a lack of adequate staffing. Meanwhile, state wildlife officials discovered that someone had removed parts of a cage used to capture sea lions near the locks. ...No National Marine Fisheries employees were on hand because the lives of some of them had been threatened if they participated in the capture and killing of sea lions....Helena Shelley, of Tacoma [said] "If they could arm the sea lions with rifles and telescopic sights and let them shoot back, then fine. At least it would be fair." end quote
Footnote to the above story: the Sealions ended up eating the salmon entering Lake Washington through the locks which destroyed the salmon population. In fact, salmon in the Pacific Northwest are now an endangered spieces thanks in part to the sealions.
From The New American, 5-13-96, page 46, by William Norman Grigg: ...In April 1989, Benson was killed by falling debris as his logging crew was being harassed by a pack of Earth First! activists. On the day of Benson's funeral, Earth First! thoughtfully sent Benson's family a card stating that the young man's death was an appropriate punishment for "murdering" trees. Earth First! involvement is also suspected in two helicopter crashes in Washington timberlands in the late 1980s. Earth First! founder Dave Foreman and four co-conspirators were arrested by federal authorities in 1989 for vandalizing power poles in Arizona in what was a trial run for an assault on nuclear power plants. ...According to the January 9th Los Angeles Times, a left- wing eco-milita group called the "Environmental Rangers" has organized near Lincoln, Montana to prevent miners from digging holes in "Mother Earth." Khaki-clad and brandishing sidearms...Ric Valois, the leader of the Rangers, promises: "That mine is not going in. They're not getting these places without a war. And I mean a real war."
From The New American, Feb. 5, 1996, by William Norman Grigg: ...Bioccentrism is close kindred to the so called "Gaia Hypothesis," which maintains that the earth is a self- regulating organism of which humanity is an insignificant part...Predictably, some disciples of Gaia have little patience with those who do not subscribe to their doctrine, and consider "unenlightened" humans to be an infestation to be eradicated...When the Clinton Administration was inaugurated in 1993, the federal bureaucracy was staffed with numerous adherents of the "biocentric" worldview, beginning with Vice President Al Gore...Alston Chase describes these officials as "apostles of the new order" and observes that they wasted little time inaugurating the new faith: "The Administration, under the rubric of `reinventing government,'...adopted biocentrism as the guiding philosophy of all federal land management" immediately on coming to power. Biocentrism is more than an ideology; it is quite literally a religion.....
From The Seattle Times, Feb. 1, 1996, page B5, by Alexander Cockburn: ...Nazi leaders were noted for love of their pets and certain animals, notably apex predators like the wolf and lion...The Nazis abolished moral distinctions between animals and people by viewing people as animals. The result was that animals could be considered `higher' than some people....The "deep ecology" types who think America's true "carrying capacity" is 200,000, who back "wildlands" projects that aim to clear people out of certain low- populated areas of the American West so that they can become "natural" again, who cheer epidemics because they think human overpopulation is the big problem - all these people should study Nazi ideologies of nature with particular care. end quote
Reply author: T&L Wheelock Racing
Replied on: 04/05/2006 5:19:37 PM
Message: When I talk about wacko or extremist environmentalists this is what I'm talking about...
Olrighty then...
SORRY I misunderstood.. but.. still have to argue..
ALL ENVIROMENTISTS ARE WHACKOs
conservationists are not... them I can work with and even be in agreement..and.. hell I can be one..
but to be an enviromentist is no different than being a cult member in that you are letting somebody else do your thinking and fill your knowledge base for you..
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 04/05/2006 7:59:49 PM
Message: ...the warming of the past century or so has failed to equal the warming that everyone enjoyed from the 8th century to the 15th century. In those halcyon days of high global temperatures, vineyards could flourish in England, cattle could graze in areas that are now icebound, and Greenland was actually green. Unfortunately, the warming period was followed by a severe global cooling that lasted until the 19th century and caused numerous farms to be abandoned as they were covered with ice. All over the world, civilization retreated from the colder regions. Going back further to the ancient world, one would find a time when the Sahara desert contained great lakes, and the entire region was wetter and warmer. Trade routes were cut across the desert that have since been abandoned due to the disappearance of the precious water..... http://www.lewrockwell.com/mcmaken/mcmaken55.html
...There is no scientific consensus. There is only the manipulation of public opinion and the effort to influence public policy. There is no rapid global warming and no way that any limits on energy use could have any effect on it if it did exist. Global warming is a classic scare campaign and we may well be witnessing its last desperate gasps as more and more scientists step forward to debunk it. http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=18526
...What Mann claimed to find was startling: The late-20th century was unusually warm — warmer than at any time in the previous six centuries. (Later research by Mann extended the climate history back 1,000 years.) The reason? "It really looks like (the recent warming) can only be explained by greenhouse gases," Mann said then. His clear implication: The Earth's climate was changing dramatically, and mankind was responsible.
Earth heats up?
The U.N. used Mann's research to declare the 1990s "the warmest decade and 1998 the warmest year of the millennium." Countless news stories picked up on this idea that the past few years have been unusually warm.
Efforts to limit the emission of the greenhouse gases blamed for this warming were bolstered by Mann's research. In fact, this week the Senate plans to consider legislation co-sponsored by Sens. John McCain, R-Ariz., and Joe Lieberman, D-Conn., to reduce the emission of greenhouse gases. McCain's Web site says, "Global warming is a growing problem. ... The 10 warmest years (on record) have all occurred since 1987." The statement is based on Mann's research.
But what if it's not true?
When McIntyre and McKitrick audited Mann's data to see whether its conclusions could be replicated, they discovered significant problems. Once they corrected the errors, the two researchers made a remarkable conclusion: The late 20th century was not unusually warm by historical standards.
Not alone in his conclusion
When asked about the paper, which had undergone review by other scientists before being published, Mann said he had heard about it but had not seen it. He called it a "political stunt" and said "dozens of independent studies published by leading journals" had come to conclusions similar to his.
What's to guarantee McKitrick and McIntyre's research will withstand the kind of scrutiny they gave Mann's research?
In an interview, McKitrick said, "If a study is going to be the basis for a major policy decision, then the original data must be disseminated and the results have to be reproducible. That's why in our case we have posted everything online and invite outside scrutiny."
Mann never made his data available online — nor did many of the earlier researchers whose data Mann relied upon for his research. That by itself raises questions about the U.N. climate-change panel's scientific process.....
http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/2003-10-28-schulz_x.htm
Reply author: Axis Of Evil
Replied on: 04/06/2006 11:53:55 AM
Message: What kills me is that the right-wing takes issue with scientists and will only consider that man could be having an effect on the global climate if extensive research points to this fact. At the same time they hail creationism as the only truth behind our existence and completely dismiss any scientific view whatsoever. Welcome back to the dark ages.
I don't know much but I do know that if you fill your house up with smoke and carbon monoxide that it has an effect on your living environment, does it not? Common sense would dictate that doing this on a grand scale will undoubtably have a negative effect on the planet's atmosphere. If I were making billions of dollars from belching filth into the sky I would completely disagree with any scientific findings too and dismiss them altogether.
I admit that someone declaring that loggers are "murdering trees" certainly qualifies them as "wacko," but wealthy capitalists completely ignoring the ramifications of avoiding proper pollution controls to increase their bottom lines should be awarded the same classification. It was only a few decades ago that oceans and waterways were used to "get rid" of mercury, lead, PCB's, etc.. They were the perfect way to rid ourselves of by-products of industrialization. We look back at these actions and think how unfortunate we were to not know any better. Those that tried to educate the world on this being a bad practice were probably considered the wackos of their time.
The first astronauts were amazed at how thin and delicate Earth's atmosphere appeared from space and all were converted to a method of thinking that it's preservation was of the utmost importance. Now why would we send a bunch of wackos into space in the first place? It couldn't be that they developed a new understanding, no. They must have gone crazy or turned communist. Everybody knows that fueling the economic engine is the highest priority, and if there is a way to reduce the costs to make a bigger profit then it must be done. The great unknown is the environmental cost, which someday we will pay.
Why is it that on average smokers die sooner than non-smokers? Well, our planet is a smoker. Should we cut it down to a pack a day or increase it to a carton? It's your call...
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 04/06/2006 1:22:24 PM
Message: Without having real science behind you and a consideration for the consequences of actions taken sometimes doing something to diminish a perceived threat, i.e. better safe then sorry, creates more harm then good. A good example would be what happened back in the 1970's when the environmental leaders were saying mankinds pollution of the atmosphere was going to cause global cooling. In response many communities stopped the practice of incinerating garbage and started burying it in landfills. While the incinerators did produce smoke harmfull substances in the garbage were for the most part eliminated in the buring process. What nobody took into consideration at the time was that as the garbage rots and decomposes in the landfills it produces the greenhouse gas methane which seeps out of the ground and into the atmosphere (btw, cockrouches and cows produce more methane then mankind and former Washington state governor, scientest and democrat Dixy Lee Ray once said the eruption of Mt. St. Helens threw more greenhouse gases into the atmosphere then mankind has put into the atmopshere since the start of the industrial revolution). Also, harmfull substances that were eliminated in the incinerators now leech into the soil and ground water. Currently, as space for new landfills diminishes we now have massive recycling throughout the country and I have read that it takes more energy to recycle a product then it does to produce a new product. Also, where I once had one garbage truck a week come through my neighorhood because of recycling I now have three garbage trucks a week coming through my neighborhood which uses up more of a natural resource, oil, and puts more polutants into the atmosphere then the one truck a week was doing.
I have more to say but I have to go sort some mail for my mailbox customers. Let me finish by saying any report from the government needs to be taken with a large grain of salt. Afterall, this is the same government that issued reports saying Saddam had WMD's.
btw, someday I'll fill you in on the fruadulant 2nd hand cigarette smoke report issued by our government.
Reply author: Drafters
Replied on: 04/07/2006 3:36:22 PM
Message: Climate changes such as global warming may be due to changes in the sun rather than to the release of greenhouse gases on Earth. Climatologists and astronomers speaking at the American Association for the Advancement of Science meeting in Philadelphia say the present warming may be unusual - but a mini ice age could soon follow.
The sun provides all the energy that drives our climate, but it is not the constant star it might seem.
Careful studies over the last 20 years show that its overall brightness and energy output increases slightly as sunspot activity rises to the peak of its 11-year cycle.
And individual cycles can be more or less active.
The sun is currently at its most active for 300 years.
That, say scientists in Philadelphia, could be a more significant cause of global warming than the emissions of greenhouse gases that are most often blamed.
The researchers point out that much of the half-a-degree rise in global temperature over the last 120 years occurred before 1940 - earlier than the biggest rise in greenhouse gas emissions.
Using ancient tree rings, they show that 17 out of 19 warm spells in the last 10,000 years coincided with peaks in solar activity.
They have also studied other sun-like stars and found that they spend significant periods without sunspots at all, so perhaps cool spells should be feared more than global warming.
The scientists do not pretend they can explain everything, nor do they say that attempts to reduce greenhouse gas emissions should be abandoned. But they do feel that understanding of our nearest star must be increased if the climate is to be understood. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/56456.stm
Fantasy Thunder Forums : http://www.elproyectovenus.org/members/forums/
© 2001-03 Fantasy Thunder
|